101

Re: Whips and weapons

David Stokes wrote:

Lets consider this shall we.......

prehaps folks (on both sides of this debate) are rather "chicken and Egg"ing this....

Whips,guns,knives,paintball guns, pencils, swords, axes, frozen chickens.......... NONE of these things are weapons. But merely TOOLS!

Since the very definition of the word weapon implies INTENT, you would have to show what INTENT that tool was used for. Take for instance "Turkey shoots" which are very popular in my part of the country. A "turkey shoot" doesnt even involve shooting a turkey at all! in fact, competitors have shotguns loaded with birdshot, shoot at targets and whoever hits the bullseye wins a FROZEN turkey!
There is alot of competition and skill in these Turkey Shoots and people spent alot of time working on shotguns designed specfically for these types of matches.
So basically, you have a shotgun that is DESIGNED to basically just punch holes in paper... THATS IT!...
so... how can that be a weapon? when its essentially just an expensive hole punch!  :-)

same thing with whips.... and for that, i do aggree with you Robby...
you cant call whips , in general, weapons..... becaue that would imply that ALL whips are DESIGNED for that purpose..... simply not true.

Not to get too off the mark here but where I live is close to cattle and I occasionally see, well, a cowboy, with his whip on his belt in a holder. No one bats an eye here. I see the reservation of those in large cities. Too many people greatly enhances danger with almost anything.

So I'm with this gentleman.

"Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read."
-Groucho Marx

102

Re: Whips and weapons

To be honest, I don't want to be hit with a whip.  Assuming the whip person was quick enough to get the whip out and crack it (those little hatband whips are pretty snappy and quick to pull out), I would be wary of getting it in the face.  I think Robby might narrow the prospect down too much.  He is saying that if pitted against a gun you have no chance.  Well, yeah.  But, a person with bad intentions will go for the easiest target.

I may have a dog in the house and it may be happy to let someone in to take whatever and even get a pat on the head for the effort, BUT a robber is less likely to target a house with a dog because they want to get in and out in a minute or less.  With a dog, they "might" get bit, there "could" be barking that will alert the neighbors, or it "might" simply be underfoot, slowing the robber down.  Therefore (and I am quoting a police officer here) a robber is less likely to hit a house with a dog when the guy down the street has no pets and is an easier target.  The same reasoning goes with someone who owns firearms.  Yeah, they are expensive and worth stealing, but a robber will be more apt to skip a gun owner's house in favor of the non-gun owner next door for the sake of "quick and easy."  There are possible variables to each story.  The dog might be harmless, the gun owner does not have a gun loaded and ready to defend with, the knife owner might only have the one big knife and it's in the dishwasher.  The shillelagh was made for self defense, but it too, is no match for a gun, you need to be close to get a good hit in, blah blah blah.  Maybe, might have, could'a, would'a, should'a.

That being said, if I had a chance in hell of getting a cracker in the eye or across my face, I would  avoid the whip cracking person in favor of an old lady with a fat purse simply because the odds of getting hurt at all, is lower.

Due to rising costs, dirty deeds are no longer done dirt cheap. 
                                                                                    ~Management

103

Re: Whips and weapons

One of my favorite scene in Raiders was when Indy meets up with the sword guy, looks at him, switches his whip to his left hand, pulls out his gun with his right, and shoots the guy.

Diagonally parked in a parallel universe.

104

Re: Whips and weapons

Mark Elliott wrote:

One of my favorite scene in Raiders was when Indy meets up with the sword guy, looks at him, switches his whip to his left hand, pulls out his gun with his right, and shoots the guy.

It is a great scene. I like it in film when things just go in a totally different direction. And ya don't bring a whip to a 'guy with a really big sword' fight.

"Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read."
-Groucho Marx

105

Re: Whips and weapons

Guy "Ocean" Jonassen wrote:
Mark Elliott wrote:

One of my favorite scene in Raiders was when Indy meets up with the sword guy, looks at him, switches his whip to his left hand, pulls out his gun with his right, and shoots the guy.

It is a great scene. I like it in film when things just go in a totally different direction. And ya don't bring a whip to a 'guy with a really big sword' fight.

I'm sure you all know that this scene was not scripted.  Harrison Ford had a seriously upset tummy, and was feeling very frail that day.  The scripted sword/whip fight was just too much for him - and the result was one of the best scenes in the film!  smile

'Less is often more!'

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Re: Whips and weapons

I did not know that, Robert, but the story seems to fit very well with my recollection of his facial expressions during that scene.

Why did she fall? Her mass distorted space-time to produce the effect we know as gravity...

107

Re: Whips and weapons

Robert Gage wrote:
Guy "Ocean" Jonassen wrote:
Mark Elliott wrote:

One of my favorite scene in Raiders was when Indy meets up with the sword guy, looks at him, switches his whip to his left hand, pulls out his gun with his right, and shoots the guy.

It is a great scene. I like it in film when things just go in a totally different direction. And ya don't bring a whip to a 'guy with a really big sword' fight.

I'm sure you all know that this scene was not scripted.  Harrison Ford had a seriously upset tummy, and was feeling very frail that day.  The scripted sword/whip fight was just too much for him - and the result was one of the best scenes in the film!  smile

Hey! You know that too. That is why he has such a disgusted look on his face. I think they got him out of the sack, he did the scene and went back to sleep.

You know I have been thinking about the post I put up earlier. Not the Indiana Jones one, but the one on whips as weapons.

Granted they are tools. But maybe I was looking at it from the wrong angle. What most people know about whips are cowboys, who assume whipped the cows rather than just moving them. There are professional crackers, who are very skilled with years behind them. "What could they do if they were angry?"

Sadly there's 500 years of oppression too. It brings up all sorts of thoughts to the civilian.

The biggest idea of it as a weapon comes from movies. I can now laugh at swinging Tarzan from a bullwhip but to millions of movie goers it is a weapon. I can walk around with one in the mall just like my Ka-Bar and no one can legally say anything. Most people are unaware of the laws here. Florida sees it as tool. Ask your average cat and she or he will give you a whole different rap. Most people just assume it's a step under a WMD and bump stock.

The whip has an implication to it. Its an ominous thing to people. They don't want to get too close. Crack it and it gets attention. I've never done anything like that but I figure those not familiar with will back off.

So after 24 some odd hours I'm thinkin' it is a psychological weapon more than any. The power to make people look, pay attention and get them away from you. On gut level makes it a very interesting tool.

Junior College Psych 101 kicked back in for a second.

And then the spark died...

"Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read."
-Groucho Marx

108

Re: Whips and weapons

Guy "Ocean" Jonassen wrote:

... The biggest idea of it as a weapon comes from movies....

Guy, I think whips were used very early on in silent films (cowboys, etc.), not least because they made a very effective visual impact.  That tradition developed further when sound came along.  That's my idea, anyway!

'Less is often more!'