1

Topic: The man, who made the bad situation public. Meet Daniel Trout :o)

In the beginning, I was not going to make this a big thing. Well, not too big... But a guy - Dan Trout - started a campaign against the members of the Ring of Trust. He obviously never read the whole text, because he's telling people not to send whips to Germany. There was never sent a whip to Germany. Anyway. He made a post on Facebook:




Please Read. To all owners of HolyOak Whips bullwhips:

It has come to my attention that there are a number of individuals who may be contacting you
to spread blatantly misleading and misinformed information about the construction techniques
used by Bobbi HolyOak in her bullwhips.

While I have no doubt that they wholeheartedly believe the information they present, I can
assure you that what they think they know and the truth of the matter are two, VERY different
things.

I have personally worked with Bobbi one-on-one, observing her whip-making techniques,
and have begun my own exploration of whip making under her guidance, and I can say as a
person who has trained with some of the finest whip artists around and has
handled
whips from some of the finest whipmakers in the world, that the accusations of poor craftsmanship
are completely unfounded. I will address that further at a later date, but for the time being,
I have a recommendation.

Don't accept the one-sided argument. Give the matter due dilligence.

I urge you to contact Bobbi directly to discuss any type of doubts this may instill in you about
their longevity, efficacy and construction and let HER address this misconception before sending
your whip off to Germany for an exchange in some seemingly gracious "Ring of Trust" endeavor.
If at that point you decide to cancel an order, return a whip, or whatever you deem is best,
DO SO THEN...

AND I would like to make an offer beyond any sort of agreement that you may come to with
Mrs. HolyOak.

IF you have a HolyOak Whips bullwhip that you have any question about, I will buy that whip
from you on the condition that it has not been mistreated or misused, (regular wear is expected.)
I'm always in need of more whips to use as trainers, and I'd rather those whips be HolyOak whips
than any other whip available.

Please direct any and all questions, offers, or comments to me personally on this Facebook page,
through the MACH ONE website or through email, (both listed below,) as comments on this post
will be deleted until Bobbi and other parties involved have settled this matter.

Thank you.

Daniel G. Trout
MACH ONE Whip Artistry
mach1whips.weebly.com
mach1whip@gmail.com






The members of the Ring of Trust are - according to Dan Trout - "a number of individuals who may be contacting you to spread blatantly misleading and misinformed information about the construction techniques used by Bobbi HolyOak in her bullwhips.". No member of the Ring of Trust ever contacted anybody to say anything about Bobbi Holyoak. Personally I think, that Dan Trout does way more harm and damage to Bobbi Holyoak's business than the thread here in the forum ever did or could do. I already wrote him that he's free to copy and paste the article from the WB forum. That would make the whole thing a bit more balanced.

Practically he is calling Simon Martin, Tyler Blake, Giovanni Celeste, Rachel McCollough and Roy Partin sneaky guys, who contact Bobbi Holyoak's customers. I don't think that this funny. I still think that he's doing very good in harming Bobbi Holyoak's reputation.

I simply don't understand, why?


Robby

I have a screwdriver. I am Legend...

2

Re: The man, who made the bad situation public. Meet Daniel Trout :o)

I have no idea of where he got the Ring of Trust involved in contacting her customers to buy whips? He must have a rich fantasy world he lives in.

Upon some research on Mach One Whip Artistry is that he "leases" her whips to people who sign up to his seminars on whip handling to those who don't want to spend money on a whip they may not want to use for more than once if they learn that they don't like cracking .... for $150.00 that is returned minus "what ever" .

This is his lease program as it's explained on his website.
http://mach1whips.weebly.com/the-mach-o … ogram.html

I notice that he also mentions Robby Amper and Whip Basics in this towards the bottom.

This leads me to suspect , I could be wrong, that he wants more of Bobbi's whips to rent for his classes to promote solely her whips. Maybe he gets a cut maybe not. But he does make money on the leased whips no matter what he says.

He also states that he will guide them in selecting a whip of good quality for them so that they don't make a mistake and buy a bad one, making learning and enjoying cracking more difficult. Then he sends them to Bobbi to order a whip.

I can't believe Bobbi would want anymore light shed on this subject by a so called "friend". I believe he thinks he's standing up for, and defending her and her whip making methods, but it's actually , I believe, doing just the opposite.

He doesn't want any more replies to his FB page but wants any responses to be by private message to him. It's too late for that Dude.

You can't un-ring a bell.

I too am at a loss as to why he's doing this against the RoT.

Ron

People who misuse the words burro and burrow, don't know their ass from a hole in the ground.

3

Re: The man, who made the bad situation public. Meet Daniel Trout :o)

Bobbi can't know what this person is doing.  What happened with the Ring of Trust is exactly what she used to describe would happen on her own website in great detail as a founder herself.  She should not expect any less.  To go and accuse the Ring of going out and hunting down customers to spread lies is absolutely ridiculous!  Where is THIS person's proof?  The customer is here that approached The Ring of Trust with his issue.  He wrote a calm and factual account of what happened with no mud slinging or slander.  No one hunted him down. 

The autopsy was done by a member of the Ring with no ties to Bobbi whatsoever and there are detailed photographs of exactly what was in the whip.  Period.  If that whip was taken apart and the autopsy showed a whip built as Bobbi stated it was built on her website, the failure would have been attributed to something else, and Robby and all of the Ring members would have made it very clear that it was no fault of Bobbi's.   It makes no difference who the whip maker is, if they are liked or not, if they are still a member here or not, The whip was built when Bobbi WAS a member of the Ring.  If the whip would have been built the way she claimed all of her whips were built on her website without tape or shrink tubing, the report would still be here, but everyone in the ring would have stood by Bobbi.  Unfortunately, as the photo documentation clearly shows, the whip did not fail because of abuse or misuse.  It failed because it was made using materials that have no business being in the whip. Materials that she, herself, says she does not ever use.   It is all right there, unbiased and photo documented with details describing how the Ring of Trust handled the customer to make him happy.  Period. 

Where is Mr Trout's proof for anything he has said?  I am positive that Bobbi has no idea what is going on.  If she did, she would put an end to this nonsense right now because she knows exactly what happened here and she knows that is exactly what was supposed to happen. 

What strikes me as even more ridiculous is the fact that Whip Basics has always conducted itself calmly.  This community is small because there is no desire for drama and sensationalism that the public seems to want so badly.  It's the people on the outside that make a point to stir up trouble where there is no trouble. Where this uninformed person feels is a justice to Bobbi, is doing nothing but lighting a match under a dead fire.  A fire that won't ruin Whip Basics, but poor Bobbi. 

What was a thread that was slowly getting buried  has now been brought to the surface and drawn attention to.  Not by Whip Basics members, but by Dan Trout. 

The thread could have been seen by a potential customer, and it would have been brought to Bobbi in conversation (because that's what civilized people do) and she, aware that there was a design flaw, could address it as she felt appropriate.  But no.  Now it is thrown in her face by the bucketloads, NOT BY WB MEMBERS, but by Dan Trout. Not only is he bringing attention to a mistake that was barely read and slowly getting buried in the archives, BUT his business serving the BDSM community might not be something a Spiritual Advisor, and Meditation and Martial Arts Expert wants to be known for.  Friend or not, she may not desire that kind of attention for her business. 

When going to war, usually the commander picks the soldiers they want to stand with them, not the other way around. 

He is no friend to Bobbi.  I hope if he reads anything from this entire thread, he reads this.  While noble in intent, there is nothing here in the forum that is a lie.  Slander is only slander if it has been published and it is untrue.  Everything said here in the forum is true, witnessed, and and can be proven.   Where is Dan's proof that a whip was sent to Germany and traded for something  else?  Where is his proof that Whip Basics members are contacting customers of Bobbi?  Please, if there is proof of this behavior, bring it forward, I will be the first member to publicly  apologize.  Spreading lies about people will not be tolerated here.

So Dan, if you are reading this, I BEG YOU, for the sake of Bobbi and her business, to think about what you say and do.  Bobbi, if you are reading please talk to this person and tell him what you already know.  You know how the Ring works.  You wrote all about it on your website when you were a member.  You were very proud to be a part of it and part of the concept in the first place.  The thread was a factual account.  It was unbiased, factual and fair.  It was not spoken about anywhere other than here and it was buried until today.   WB did not unbury it, but DAN TROUT did.  A man who thinks he knows what is going on, but has never even taken the time to read the story.  He fights for hearsay.  He is using Bobbi's design flaw to obtain whips, and he is starting a fight that would  have never went further than the archives of Whip Basics, until now thanks to HIM.

If you fall, I'll be there.
                            ~Floor

4

Re: The man, who made the bad situation public. Meet Daniel Trout :o)

I am not a member of the Ring of Trust, but as a member of Whip Basics Forum, I'm taking this personally.
I replied on FB questioning who he was talking about and did not get an answer.
http://i.imgur.com/sYHkK1X.jpg

He doesn't understand the damage he is doing to Bobbi.
Granted this is a self inflicted wound Bobbi made by using the shoddy methods in making the whip in question, but this guy is just bringing a magnifying glass to the whole thing and blaming "others" for the problem.

Ron

People who misuse the words burro and burrow, don't know their ass from a hole in the ground.

5

Re: The man, who made the bad situation public. Meet Daniel Trout :o)

He won't put up the facts because he knows he is lying.  Classic behavior of someone who has no facts, is to deny the truth to be heard.

If you fall, I'll be there.
                            ~Floor

6

Re: The man, who made the bad situation public. Meet Daniel Trout :o)

I missed the fact where he drags the name of the Ring through the mud.
That's not nice. Is it perhaps jealousy? Or a way to get cheap whips?

I find it disgusting to publicly humiliate someone or something with lies.
Unfortunately the world's full of strange people doing strange things.
It's dealing with them that's the problem.

Sven

-Junior, I didn't know you could fly a plane?
-Fly yes..., land no.

7

Re: The man, who made the bad situation public. Meet Daniel Trout :o)

This fella simply needs to read the facts and see the whip autopsy, then he won't be running his mouth so much. Nobody here wishes bad luck on Bobbi. The facts were simply presented.

He died for me, I'll live for him

8

Re: The man, who made the bad situation public. Meet Daniel Trout :o)

In all fairness i have to admit that i have might contributed a little to some of this.

One of my friends, a whip fanatic who has two whips from Gio one on order from Tyler and a few other good whips has an order at Holyoak.

He has prepaid the whip and is looking forward to get it.

I informed him that there had been problems with at least one whip.

He then contacted Bobbi who has promised him that his whip will be to the highest standard - with no schrink tubing inside.

I did this not to ruin Bobbi´s reputation - but to ensure that my friend gets the whip quality he expected.

If this has resulted in turmoil - i appologise - but as said - no harm intended

9

Re: The man, who made the bad situation public. Meet Daniel Trout :o)

No worries Morten.
You didn't do anything wrong. You were just looking out for your friend.

Ron

People who misuse the words burro and burrow, don't know their ass from a hole in the ground.

10

Re: The man, who made the bad situation public. Meet Daniel Trout :o)

In all seriousness, as someone who tries to be as unbiased as possible, I can see where he is coming from, but unfortunately most of his claims seem to be fantasies of his, which annoys me. He *thinks* the RoT is contacting people...for some reason. It's not like they have a list of people who've bought from Bobbi before, so how would they?
Furthermore, saying that this is a "one-sided argument" is stupid. There is literally photo proof of the whip being taken apart, in an as fair as possible way. Yet, I don't see proof of these messages or "misleading information".
Finally, deleting comments is just a coward's way out, I feel. It's almost telling you that he's not willing to talk about this, until you close all doors so no one else knows.

Give a man a fire and he's warm for the day. But set fire to him and he's warm for the rest of his life.

11

Re: The man, who made the bad situation public. Meet Daniel Trout :o)

Morten - no worries  smile  You have every right to advice and/or recommend anything to a friend. I think that Bobbi told that to her friend - Dan Trout - and suddenly it was "The RT members contact Bobbi's customers". That is not only complete bullshit. It is a very bad and serious accusation. Again - Morten - no problem. You did exactly the right thing!

Robby

I have a screwdriver. I am Legend...

12

Re: The man, who made the bad situation public. Meet Daniel Trout :o)

Thank you Robby, as said hope i didnt cause trouble by this

13

Re: The man, who made the bad situation public. Meet Daniel Trout :o)

Sparky touched on what I was going to say, but how would we know who to contact?  Like we have a database of Bobbi's customers?  So the entire basis for this is seriously flawed!

Yaprimascharif, Yahasanna Hadisany, elafinas tabachu, Dari chalemy elasin!

14

Re: The man, who made the bad situation public. Meet Daniel Trout :o)

To make sure that it is not overlooked - here is a copy of the post with the pictures & infos:




Bobbi Holyoak ( www.Holyoak-whips.com ) was removed from the “Whip Basics Ring of Trust“. Shortly after that, I was contacted by a customer, who had issues with a whip he bought from Mrs. Holyoak. At the time he contacted me, he was aware that Mrs. Holyoak was no longer a member of the WB Ring of Trust. And that the guarantee and service which is assured by the members of the RoT - and myself - did not apply to her anymore. I brought this to the attention of the other members of the RoT and we all agreed that we have to help this customer, because, when he bought that whip from Holyoak whips, Mrs. Holyoak was a member of the RoT. And so we came to the conclusion that we are still responsible and we took full responsibility. The customer got a new whip - for free - made by Rachel McCollough from Wolfcreek Whips ( www.WolfCreekWhips.com ).



The whip was sent to one of the Members of the RoT for inspection. It was taken apart carefully and every step was documented. I will not comment on the pictures to avoid the impression that I am not neutral. And to be completely politically correct, the whip was inspected by a female whip maker: Mrs McCollough. One thing I have to mention is this: Mrs. Holyoak states until the present day (July 22, 2017) on her website, the following:


Quote:
"HolyOak whips are built using 550 & 650 nylon paracord, which does not mildew or rot. All whips have at least one braided belly as well as traditional bolsters.  I never use tape in the construction of my bolsters because every whip is waxed using the submersion technique.“..."I love my whips and take a lot of pride in each one.  I want you to love them too. I do have a formula that I use to make them but I am always tweaking things to improve the whips."

End Quote.



This is an example of how the Whip Basics Ring of Trust works. When I founded the Ring of Trust, I set the highest possible standards. Therefore the RoT has only a few members. Info on the Whip Basics Ring of Trust you will find right here:  http://www.whip-basics.com/trust/ From this point on I can’t recommend Holyoak-whips anymore. Please keep in mind, that if you buy from Holyoak-whips, the Ring of Trust is not responsible and we can’t help you from now on if you experience something like this. I won’t make any more comments on that matter. Here are the pictures with detailed descriptions.


Robert Amper
Founder of Whip Basics
Founder of the Whip Basics Ring of Trust





http://i.imgur.com/LwXlNOE.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/PuqJ3rt.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/8a9hzdm.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/jaVC5Vt.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/QtxcFfw.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/XJHHQEh.jpg



Explanation on the unknown purple material - Heat shrink

The use of heat shrink has been discussed on and off in the forum for over a year.  Each time it has been brought up, it was always discussed as a possibility, something that could be tried and tested. When seeing these photographs, the “unknown substance” was suspected to be heat shrink. One of our members started out as an electrician, but moved on to getting his degree as a master diesel mechanic, with a specialty in electrical.  He sees this substance every day and he confirmed my suspicions. That is most definitely heat shrink tubing. When asking about the properties of this product, he had this to say:

1.
Heat shrink is for isolating wires.  It is color coded because different wires do different things. Colors make differentiating what goes where easier.  This is why you find it in all colors.

2.
Wires, whether in a wall or in a vehicle are not meant to have to move. Therefore, heat shrink was not designed to move. At first it is somewhat flexible and rubbery, but that does not last long and eventually it will become brittle and crack.  This is very apparent in the photographs.  There is a crack at the hinge point between the barn spike and the first BB, and subsequently, a crack.

3.
Heat shrink is plastic and waterproof. There is no way for wax to be able to penetrate through all layers of the whip with heat shrink on the thong.

4.
Like electrical tape, heat shrink is not meant to be a valid replacement for binding a whip with sinew. It is not made to move, or flex. While this is not electrical tape, it is equal to it.  It is a faster and more ergonomic method of wrapping wires to isolate them.  It is a simpler form of electrical tape. 




http://i.imgur.com/JyZVopE.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/oOYkYKJ.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/crXrTdd.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/v5BZTPN.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/0GH0act.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/aL2sDNb.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/l35rsA0.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/7VomuDn.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/Lq5b4p1.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/UzTX4Kr.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/cVvk5Wq.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/CKg3E8l.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/S5Hc749.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/l39VGNG.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/EejFS6H.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/jYAWYgE.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/TmIGIVQ.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/JtBIDW6.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/INfXBhd.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/NE7uo5W.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/TDiV13f.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/ouvSoIY.jpg

I have a screwdriver. I am Legend...

15

Re: The man, who made the bad situation public. Meet Daniel Trout :o)

Thanks again for this Robby. The proof is in the pudding and I just looked at many pictures of spoiled pudding! It is what it is..

The Truth!

16

Re: The man, who made the bad situation public. Meet Daniel Trout :o)

The fact that there is somebody arguing against photographic evidence is just ridiculous. Much as Robby said, the way Dan Trout is reacting to this, the words he says and such, do more harm than good. First, he is calling out all the reputations of the RoT members; because of course, whipmaker are such a cut throat group of people, always stepping on the little people to make sure they maintain their business, right? This is absolutely not the case; should anyone take the time to actually learn about the Ring, and the other members in general, they would see that this group holds itself to a certain standard. Everybody here has a set of requirements they have to adhere to. Second, it seems to me that he contradicts himself, and thus calls into question the reputation of his own organization. He seems to say that in his experience, there are no problem with Holyoak Whips, but if he's wrong and there are problems, he'll buy them for his own use. Seems to me he's saying he will buy inferior whips for professional use.

The evidence can be found right here, on this forum. A series of very detailed "autopsy" photos were taken of the whip in question. If you really need to have proof of what is being contested, look at them. It really cannot he any more obvious than that.

Now and then we had a hope that if we lived and were good, God would permit us to be pirates.
          -Mark Twain

17

Re: The man, who made the bad situation public. Meet Daniel Trout :o)

I fail to understand why Mr Trout is making this fuss. The photos are unanswerable. The actions of the Ring of Trust - on record here - are impeccable. What does he hope to gain? Would it not be better to drop the whole thing?

'Less is often more!'

18

Re: The man, who made the bad situation public. Meet Daniel Trout :o)

Mr. Robert, you are exactly correct. It would have been much better for Bobbi if the whole thing simply died away. For Mr. Trout to dig it up and spread lies just started a huge flame. The Ring of Trust worked and those people are mad about it? That's just crazy.

He died for me, I'll live for him

19

Re: The man, who made the bad situation public. Meet Daniel Trout :o)

Am 28.08.2017 um 03:29 schrieb Daniel Trout <mach1whips@gmail.com>:

Robby,

Thank you for your time in responding to this. 

First of all, I only requested that you remove the links and references to my site.  I have no idea what you are referring to in terms of "...As I demanded" in changing the title of any thread.  I have "demanded" nothing.   

ALSO, I never claimed the whip was sent to Germany for examination.  I never mentioned Rachel McCullough nor Wolf Tree Whips, though I read very clearly who did it.  I said nothing about that who did the examining, nor the situation which prompted the action taken  My statement was simply this:

"While I have no doubt that they wholeheartedly believe the information they present, I can assure you that what they think they know and the truth of the matter are two, VERY different things.
I have personally worked with Bobbi one-on-one, observing her whip-making techniques, and have begun my own exploration of whip making under her guidance, and I can say as a person who has trained with some of the finest whip artists around and has handled whips from some of the finest whipmakers in the world, that the accusations of poor craftsmanship are completely unfounded. I will address that further at a later date, but for the time being, I have a recommendation.

Don't accept the one-sided argument. Give the matter due diligence."

I urge you to contact Bobbi directly to discuss any type of doubts this may instill in you about their longevity, efficacy and construction and let HER address this misconception before sending your whip off to Germany for an exchange in some seemingly gracious "Ring of Trust" endeavor.

If at that point you decide to cancel an order, return a whip, or whatever you deem is best, DO SO THEN...

The statement of "Sending it to Germany" might as well have said "Send it to Abu Dhabi."  I don't know the process you use, nor as a non-member of Whip Basics do I really care to.  I was simply saying "Before you, a concerned owner of a HolyOak Whips bullwhip, do anything, talk to Bobbi..."

If you would like for me to publicly clarify these statements about "Sending a Whip to Germany," I will gladly do so as I can see how that statement could be misconstrued, especially by folks for whom English, (and especially the American Vernacular,) is a second language.

That stated, I myself attempt to follow considerable due diligence to report fact, and I appreciate your efforts to bring me up to speed on matters I may have not had all the information on.  With that honesty and dedication to fact as our common ground, let me tell you what I know.

The whip sent to Mz. McCullough for examination was a $50 children's whip.  It was made SPECIFICALLY for a child, not an adult.  I have recently handled a similar childs whip that was made by Mrs. HolyOak.  I found the craftsmanship to be superb and the handling second to none for what it was.   BUT it was a $50 children's whip.  It's was a GREAT little whip for a kid, but to expect it to have an identical performance and construction to one of her $300USD Valkyries is as ludicrous as expecting a $150USD Dell laptop to outperform a $2000USD high-end Alienware computer built for a serious gamer.

If this whip was represented to you as anything beyond being a children's whip, similar to the hatband whips, little snappers, or pocket whips that many whipmakers sell as novelties, then you have been mislead, and I genuinely hope that an artisan member of the Ring didn't sell their skill short making a replacement for it that would go for $300 USD retail because that is not fair to them or to the Ring itself.

The artificial sinew binding was not wrapped as tightly for that reason.  It was meant to be have good flexibility and flow for a child, not an adult.  Based upon the appearance of the core of the whip that Mz. McCollough received, it appears to me that an adult was over-muscling said whip. 

That however is pure conjecture on my part, admittedly.   

What is NOT conjecture, and what seems to be the whole knot of contention in the your post in Autopsy of a Whip is the "unknown purple material" that you have identified as shrink tubing.

This is an understandable misconception, and as the "Autopsy" was done several thousand miles from you, there was no way for you to closely examine the material, and there is no reason for Mz. McCullough to examine it beyond what you understandably assumed.

The purple material, (an untreated section of which sits here on my desk as I type this,) is indeed a proprietary heat-activated material that has a nylon webbing component as it's base.  It will not get brittle, it will not break down as the shrink-tubing for wiring harnesses will.

Beyond that, I know very little else about it, save that the particular diameters and lengths that Mrs. HolyOak uses in her whips were manufactured specifically for her needs.  It is not regularly commercially available.  As someone who has, as stated, worked directly with Bobbi in beginning my own exploration of whip making, I had the same questions and concerns that you had as I applied it to the core of the whip I was making.  The above was explained to me. 

The disconnection and apparent "cracking" in the material in the "Autopsy" photos look to me like an abuse issue by an adult, (as previously stated,) moreso that a construction issue.  However, that is certainly open to interpretation.  I do know that the material is used in all of the Valkyrie, DeLongis Alignment, Sonic Alignment, and Tibetan Wave bullwhips, and having just spent a weekend handling bullwhips owned by Ron Lew, Anthony Delongis, (for whom it is not unusual to be working with a whip for hours at a time every day of the week,) and other previous customers, (my own four HolyOak Whips included.)  Not a single one of those whips showed any signs at all of any physical breakdown or loss of flexibility.

And that is where we leave this.  The information is there.  The facts have been presented on both sides, and I feel we both were lacking some critical details here, so thank you for this productive exchange.

What we choose to accept and/or contest as facts are up to us individually and to Bobbi's customers.  I stand by my statements, and if you feel the need to bring lawyers into it, I can and will do nothing to stop you.  Nor will I let that deter me in my pursuit of facts, I believe we ultimately want the same thing here, and if you feel the need to pursue the matter legally, so be it. 

I also stand by my statements that if anyone in the Whip Basics Community, (you included,) feels that they want divest themselves of their HolyOak bullwhips, I will pay a fair price for them on the condition that they have not been misused or abused.  I don't offer it as a slight against you or your colleagues in the Ring of Trust.  I greatly respect the idea and the artisans that carry it forward.  I merely offer it as an alternative for them to chose from, as I personally feel in this instance you are mistaken.  But that is, again, not my decision nor place to make 

Thank you for your time, dedication, and civility in this matter.

Respectfully,

Dan

If you fall, I'll be there.
                            ~Floor

20

Re: The man, who made the bad situation public. Meet Daniel Trout :o)

1.  I added in the above because the subjects discussed have been discussed during the course of this and I felt the actual email would be adequate for full disclosure. 

2.  "The purple material, (an untreated section of which sits here on my desk as I type this,) is indeed a proprietary heat-activated material that has a nylon webbing component as it's base.  It will not get brittle, it will not break down as the shrink-tubing for wiring harnesses will.
Beyond that, I know very little else about it, save that the **particular diameters and lengths that Mrs. HolyOak uses in her whips were manufactured specifically for her needs.  It is not regularly commercially available.  ***As someone who has, as stated, worked directly with Bobbi in beginning my own exploration of whip making, I had the same questions and concerns that you had as I applied it to the core of the whip I was making.  The above was explained to me. "

a.  *It broke.  The pictures show it broke.  You are lying. 
b.  **You can buy shrink tube at any length and size and can cut it to what you need.  To say Bobbi has a specific alien substance made just for her to her specifications that no one else can buy is far fetched.
c.***So, what you are saying here is, that however long ago it was that you were learning to make whips, Bobbi told you to use this "substance" as a binding method.  You were concerned and questioned it, but she assured  you as you made your own whip under her tutelage  that is was fine?  So you use it in your whips too?  What whips were you two building that you used this stuff that never breaks and is made from such high tech polymer material that it is specially made just for Bobbi?  Did I mention that the shit broke?  It broke.  Photos show...it broke. 

3.  It's WOLFCREEK WHIPS and it's MRS.  You can use big fat $100 words, but you cant use someone's proper name Mr Fish?  If you are going to pretend to be respectful, be respectful.  I am more impressed by someone willing to go back and make sure they are using a proper name than fawning over a thesaurus. 

4.  I can pick this email apart and point out the inconsistencies, but you aren't stupid people.  Read it for yourself.  It's plumb full of entertainment.

If you fall, I'll be there.
                            ~Floor